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Re: Advaita (was Re: Siva as Yogi?)
keutzer@Synopsys.COM (Kurt Keutzer) writes:
>First of all it may be worthwhile to consider the question: ``What is the
>purpose of this discussion?'' or more generally ``What is the purpose of a
>tenet (or philosophical) system?'' The only interest that I have in a
>discussion in SRH is one that seeks to elevate my state of undertanding and
>through a cognitive transformation to help lead me from a state of
>ignorance, marked by emotional suffering, to a state of enlightenment,
>marked by contentment and an absence of suffering. Similarly, what I seek
>in a tenet system is a viewpoint that produces, or aids in producing, a
>similar effect.
Though no system or tenets can produce a state of enlightenment,
dispelling ignorance and answering the question 'who am I' will certainly
do. imho, Advaita vedanta and jnana marga in general will not help you
to "lead" anywhere but will show you who is the person actually thinking
he is ignorant, marked by suffering while the I is already enlightened.
The path of jnana marga have produced enlightened beings like Ramana
Maharishi, Nisargadatta Maharaj etc. If you want to argue they are not
self-realized because they don't have a "genuine" sampradaya which can be
traced back to Krishna, I cannot argue with you.
>acknowledge that I need to wake-up. The methodology for this that you, and
>apparently Advaita, are offering me is to simply stop acknowledging the
>reality of the dream. I think that this is definitely worth trying once.
>This approach apparently worked for Ramana Maharshi. I would say that
>something similar worked for Hui Neng, ``the 6th Patriarch of Zen.''
>However, having tried this viewpoint and my ignorance was not dispelled
>(i.e. I did not wake up) then I don't see what Advaita has to offer me. To
>simply continue to repeat (ad nauseum ;-) ) Mahavakyas, quote
>Shankaracarya, Gaudapadacarya, or the Upanishads doesn't change my state of
>ignorance.
>I would put it differently. Criticisms of Advaita Vedanta come from the
>fact that from the standpoint of philosophical discussion pure Advaita
>Vedanta, as you are expositing it, is about as interesting as solipsism. I
>think that a a computer program can be written that passes the Turing test
>as an exponent of Advaita Vedanta.
>Mangalam,
>Kurt
Blindly quoting the scriptures or Shankara, Gaudapada certainly
would not help in dispelling the ignorance per se. What it does (imho) is
instigate a spirit of self-inquiry to asking "who is this actually
suffering ? who is this person thinking he is bound ?".
While I respect your opinion, and your claim that you have tried
the view point of Ramana Maharishi of self-enquiry, I am stuck by your
claim that a computer program would pass the Turing test as an exponent
of Advaita Vedanta. I am really sorry if that you really feel this
considering the failure of the present Turing tests even for simple
tasks. Further, enquiry into Truth by Advaitans may not be even interesting
as solipsism but it is just that 'it is an enquiry into Truth,
not entertainment [to the layman]'.
If you are really interested in self-inquiry, look into
http://ddi.digital.net/~egodust. Maybe this path is not suited for you, since
you already have seem to made up your mind on the usefulness of Advaita
vedanta as applied to daily life. Maybe not.
Giri
--
{I don't speak for anyone, much less myself}
http://www.geopages.com/RodeoDrive/1415 <---> Yoga and Spirituality page
Brahma Satyam, Jagat Mithya, Jivo Brahmaiva Na Parah. - Shankara
'I want to know God's thoughts, the rest are details' -- Albert Einstein
