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Re: ARTICLE : SRH Reorganization
In article <ghenDvHMDC.By8@netcom.com>,
Sandeep Vaishnavi <svaishnavi@bosco.meis.uab.edu> wrote:
>>By all means, quote whatever you want, but recall what you mentioned -
>>you said that you'd show that I used ISKCON's name in connection with
>>the children's book. I didn't.
Those lines above are what I had said, and despite all of the
handwaving and righteous indignation Mr. Vaishnavi has heaped in this
most recent article, he still hasn't shown that claim to be true.
> Just *who* are you trying to fool? You ask for "proof" and
>when the proof is in your own words, you state "quote whatever
>you want..."
Mr Vaishnavi, I believe it is you who are trying to fool people, since
you cloud what would otherwise be a reasonable argument with a coating
of lies and exaggerations, and you don't have the decency to admit
them with shown exactly why your hyperbole doesn't support your
argument.
> When you can't defend your arguments and you've been caught
> red-handed, you like to harp on technicalities. Recall what I said:
It's more than technicalities - remember when you said
SV> Think about it - a person who is a vigorous, even aggressive ISKCON
SV> supporter flails Mr. Shah for not supporting SRV
or even
SV> What's even more disturbing to me
SV> is that these few individuals are using ISKCON's name in this vindictive,
SV> vendetta-like action.
Both of those statements were totally untrue, yet when confronted,
you've failed to support them. They usually end up clipped from your
responses. Even the statements that do get left in, like
>>SV> Look, Vivek, you yourself had a posting not too long ago where
>>SV> you extolled your work for ISKCON (you talked about a children's book,
Take on a new meaning for you. That book isn't part of ISKCON, and I'm
not doing it for ISKCON. I might end up selling it at some reasonable
cost, I might donate the rights to whomever is interested, or I might
just go ahead and publish the whole thing on the web for
free. However, there's no truth to the claim that I'm doing it for
ISKCON.
> The claim had to do about your association with ISKCON (note I
>didn't say membership in).
That was one of the claims, and that wasn't a claim I contested. The
claims I contested were the outright lies that were spinkled in to try
to support the less damning claims. However let's look at where you
try to support the more outrageous claims:
The following lines are when you quoted me:
> "Now, beyond that, it's fair to ask, 'well, the FWR site tries to
>contradict ritvik philosophy, but do you do things which stand on their
>own'. The answer, of course, is yes. I'm currently in the process of
>putting together a Krishna-Conscious *cookbook* [emphasis is mine] aimed
>at young children. It's geared towards a 'lesson plan' format where the
>children not only learn how to cook, but they also get some Vaishnava
>philosophy in the process. If anyone has recipes they'd like to
OK, so you added your emphasis to the cookbook part, which is a bit
amusing, but what is missing is the real support for the claim that
you made. Simply put, it's not there. ISKCON has enough cookbooks, and
given that the cookbook I want to put together will have a very
limited "market," I don't even see the point of making it a major
project. It's my own project, primarily for my own benefit, and if
anyone else wants to help, I'd be more than happy to have them help.
However, it's not an ISKCON project, I'm clearly _not_ doing it for
ISKCON, and it's hard for me to understand why you can't accept that.
The cookbook will include Vaishnava philosophy, and it will include
recipes from a Krishna-Conscious standpoint, but that doesn't
automatically make it part of ISKCON.
>contribute, I'd be more than happy to consider them. Monetary recompense
>, however, is not likely, since the book is probably going to be given
>away free. Of course, I do other stuff as well - if you recall some of
>the Houston Temple's Prabhupada Centennial T-shirts mentioned on ARV a
>long time ago, I helped out with those, and I also helped together the
>Houston Temple's Janmastami T-shirts a year or two ago."
>
> Well, Mr. Pai, here you are in your *own words* extolling your
>work for ISKCON (and on top of that, you *did* mention the cookbook).
Actually, if you look closely, I don't even mention ISKCON, and if you
want to know who I did that work for, it wasn't for ISKCON. A friend
of mine was put in charge of those shirts, and given that I have some
reasonable skills in that area, I offered to help. I don't consider
anything that you've quoted showing your claim that I've "extoll[ed]
[my] work for ISKCON," because it simply isn't there. I helped out a
friend in a project he was doing.
Now, as far as "mentioning the cookbook", take a look at your original
claim:
>>SV> Look, Vivek, you yourself had a posting not too long ago where
>>SV> you extolled your work for ISKCON (you talked about a children's book,
You include the cookbook in the parenthetical expression, which is
added to support the "work for ISKCON". Since the cookbook is clearly
not "work for ISKCON," you've failed to prove your claim. Note in your
new defense of the quote, you shift your emphasis:
SV> Well, Mr. Pai, here you are in your *own words* extolling your
SV>work for ISKCON (and on top of that, you *did* mention the cookbook).
Instead of the cookbook being an example of your claim, as you stated
earlier, the cookbook now becomes something that's now just
"mentioned," but that was never in question. In other words, once
confronted, you shifted the focus of attack.
>ISKCON! If you can, then I'll gladly accept your proof along with an
>apology for your harming ISKCON's reputation.
You, my dear sir, haven't shown it to be within your authority to
accept such an apology. But more bluntly, nobody died and made you
king.
However, if you're looking for something useful to do, I'm still
looking for recipes suitable for young children. I have a few, but
would like some more. Ideally, the recipes should avoid flame and
knives, and should take a very short time to prepare. Of course, they
can only use ingredients suitable for offering to Krishna. Anyone who
would like to contribute is encouraged to get in touch with me.
-Vivek
