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Re: superstitions

Hi Jaldhar,
        Thanks for the comments and views.
> Manish is right.  Vivekananda was an idiot.
 I fully support your freedom to pass ANY judgement on ANYONE. I know many
people who call Jesus an idiot, Krishna a pervert, Rama a chauvinist and
even God a dumb!!!!! So what?? That only shows their opinions and understanding
and does not necessarily mean True.
>Well, irrationality does seem to be one of Manish's problems so let me
>step in.  Heres logical proof.  To teach something you have to understand
>it yourself first.  Vivekananda was a civil servant with not a shred of
>knowledge of Sanskrt.  How can the views of such a person be taken
>seriously on such a complex subject as Vedanta?  Heres empirical proof.
>The membership of the Ramakrishna mission is miniscule compared to
>traditionalist sects.  This even applies in America were presumably more
>modern and less bound by custom.  This suggests that the Vivekanand and his
>view of religious life is rejected by most Hindus.
 Honestly I do not know whether you are being sarcastic or serious in this
criticism. When did passing Sanskrit 101 become a pre-requisite for
excelling in Vedanta?? How do you know that Vivekananda did not know a
"shred of Sanskrit"??  Also forgive me for picking, but whoever said Vedanta
is a "subject" in ordinary sense of dictionary meaning in the first place??
Also please pardon me for questioning, when did statistics of how big
Ramakrishan mission is, how tall its structures are and how huge its funds
are compared to other sects, and how many people are its members like a
modern political party, become a CRITERION to qualify for being closer
to Truth- that too deep, subjective and intrinsic Truth?????? Does any of this
constitute as PROOF to decry, degrade and denigrate the work and teachings of
Vivekananda?? You conclude please.
>Spiritual proof.
>Vivekanandas "thought" is supposedly Advaita Vedanta.  Even the most ardent
>Vivekanandist has to admit that this is not true and in fact his thought has
>no relation to the prasthana trayi or the millenium long
>tradition that followed it.
I do not understand why you think anyone HAS to admit that Advaita is NOT true?
Is it just your conjecture?? Also I did not find anything that Vivekananda
preached as against the Upanishads we have, and in fact his teachings are
more articulate and had practical suggestions and tips to our present world.
>How could it when Vivekananda couldn't even read Sanskrit?  However, even
>illiterate people can understand Dharma if they have a Satguru.  Vivekanandas
>supposed Guru Ramakrishna didn't know anything either.  (Remember, he became
>the pujari of Dakshineshwar because he was too feeble-minded to study in his
>brothers school.)  So if the followers of Vivekananda consider themselves to
>be Vedantins, they are lying.  That's not very spiritual is it?  Sorry I can't
>give you any actual-experience proof but I wasn't alive back then. <G>
I am clueless as to your premises of logic here. Please help me! If you
conclude that Sri Ramakrishna did not know anything because:
(a) He was illiterate and (b) Because he was mere pujari ,
then I would think that you might have written it as a joke and not in any
seriousness. Really, does such externalities give us accurate estimate
of the spiritual import and accomplishments of any one?? For that matter what
Sanskrit debates did the cow-herd urchin, and village rustic win to become
the character in the Vyasa Publications of Gita??? Krishna was not even a
pujari!! Born in a prison, grown amidst village urchins, nothing better
to do than stealing butter and following Pandavas in forests, holding no
dignified portfolio in the military assignments of Kurushetra, it looks like
He was good for nothing materialistically!!!! Yes, according to your logic
we can even say He knows nothing!!! That show of externalities cannot reveal
the depth or profundity of the Supreme Personality nor do these outer
things portray the Divinity and the quintessential Truth manifested. To judge
by outer things is to miss for ourselves the nobility and the goodness these
manifestations of the Truth connote.
        Take for that matter any spirutual giant who guided and moved his
generations and even many generations to greater understanding and peace and
harmony. Analyse what their accomplishments are materialistically and we
will find to our utter surprise they have very minimal of these. There may be
great orators and logicians who can prove and exhort about the goodness
of non-violence, but how many can inspire their generation to actually LIVE it
like Gandhiji?? Compassion for Buddha, Mercy for Christ, Devotion for Chaitanya
and the list goes on.
>ALL Vivekananda ever did was preach.
Oops, sorry, we might have mistaken one person for another!! Actually, I was
talking about one guy called Vivekananda from Bengal who lived till 1903!!!
>The only people who seem to be mentioning Vivekananda much these days are
>the BJP and the VHP.  I thought you were against narrow-minded fanatics?
 Let me confess that neither I subscribe to BJP philosophy nor am I a member
of VHP. And this dirty game of exploitation of ANYTHING, be it God or even
Holiest Temples or Shrines, by humans to achieve their ends is neither new,
nor original. In the name of Ganesh, people used to collect donation in my
town and use it to get drunk!! But I would not hold Ganesh responsible for
that, or should I ?? You tell me!!
With best regards

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