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Re: Srila Prabhupada speaks out -- Christ, Christians, & Krishna (fwd)

I found this article very interesting, and i appreciate what Srila 
Prabhupada is trying to do, but it doesn't work when you also look at 
what the bible says about Jesus's life. Now i don't put much stock in the 
miracle stories and spiritual claims that the bible makes, but it is the 
best record that there is of Jesus' life, because there isn't any other 
outside information besides the biblical stories to draw upon. So when 
you look at what the bible actually reports Jesus as saying, it doesn't 
work with some of what Prabhupada says about him:

 Vijay Sadananda Pai (vijaypai@ece.rice.edu) wrote:
: Forwarded from alt.religion.vaisnava
: (originally posted by Vijay Pai)
: ------------------

: Srila Prabhupada Speaks Out: On Christ, Christians, and Krsna

: (BTG -- Volume 12, No. 12. Dec. 1977)
[snip]
: Christ, the Friend Of All Living Beings

: A preacher of God consciousness is a friend to all living beings. Lord Jesus
: Christ exemplified this by teaching, "Thou shalt not kill." But the Christians
: like to misinterpret this instruction. They think the animals have no soul, and
: therefore they think they can freely kill billions of innocent animals in the
: slaughterhouses. So although there are many persons who profess to be
: Christians, it would be very difficult to find one who strictly follows the
: instructions of Lord Jesus Christ.

Jesus never said: "Thou shalt not kill" except once when referring to the 
Old Testament commandment. It was not specifically his teaching, and (as 
you'll see below) it did not refer to animals, nor even to all humans.

Jesus ate meat: KJV transl Matt. 25:35 "I was hungry and you gave me
meat.." in many places he is referred to as sitting down "to meat." In the
desert he supposedly multiplied bread *and fish* for a large crowd, and
"all of them ate." (matt. 15:34-38) Jesus also said: "It is not what goes
into the mouth that defiles a person, but it is what comes out of the
mouth that defiles." (Matt. 15:11) Thus he believed that eating meat was
not a bad thing.  Before his betrayal, he ate a Passover meal which
includes lamb. Paul, who supposedly had enough spiritual authority given
to him for his writings to be included in the bible, says: "Now the Spirit
(God) expressly says that in later times some will renounce the faith by
paying attention to deceiftul spirits, through the hypocrisy of liars
whose consciences are seared with a hot iron. They forbid marriage and
demand abstinence from foods (*meat*), which God created to be received with
thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth." (1 Tim 4:1-3)

He also said: "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came 
not to send peace but a sword." (Matt 10:34) and "He that hath no sword, 
let him sell his garment, and buy one" (Luke 22:36)  Is this supposed to 
be for decoration?  He makes this statement (many say it is the last part 
of a parable, but some disagree): "But as for these enemies of mine who 
did not want me to be king over them -- bring them here and slaughter 
them in my presence." (luke 19:27)  The Jews around the time of Jesus 
believed that the Messiah would come and overthrow the Roman occupation 
of Jerusalem, thus ushering in the "Messianic Age", and there is good 
reason to believe that this was Jesus's real intention (see Hyam 
Maccoby's _The Myth-Maker: Paul and the Invention of Christianity_), 
although the writers of the gospels would have us believe otherwise. 

It doesn't appear to me that Srila Prabhupada has taken a good look at 
what Jesus actually said and did. 

: Jesus Is Our Guru

: Actually, anyone who is preaching God's glories must be accepted as a guru.

Pat Robertson? Jerry Falwell? Jim Jones? (shudder)

: Jesus Christ is one such great personality. We should not think of him as an
: ordinary human being. The scriptures say that anyone who considers the
: spiritual master to be an ordinary man has a hellish mentality. If Jesus Christ
: were an ordinary man, then he could not have delivered God consciousness.

What exactly was he then?  

: consciousness movement. They should chant the name Christ or Christos and
: should stop condoning the slaughter of animals. This is not some philosophy
: that I have fabricated; it is taught in the Bible.

Where is this taught in the Bible? "Thou shalt not kill" is part of the 
10 commandments in the Old Testament (not a specific teaching of Jesus') 
and refers only to some human beings. (There is a huge list of things 
that people can be stoned to death for in the bible, and there are 
numerous orders from YHWH (God the Father) to exterminate whole 
populations of human beings.)  

This same Old Testament that proclaims "Thou shalt not kill" also has a 
whole list of animal sacrafices to be performed for various offenses, 
specifically in the book of Leviticus. If Jesus was a good Jew (which 
presumably he was) then he would have participated in these animal 
sacrifices at the temple in Jerusalem. In fact, Jesus said: "I am not 
come to abolish the law... whoever breaks the least of these 
commandments, and teaches others to do the same, will be called the least 
in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does them and teaches them will be 
called great in the kingdom of heaven." (matt 5:17-19) This includes the 
Jewish laws of animal sacrifice, folks. In fact the only reason that the 
Jews don't perform animal sacrifice today is because the temple at 
Jerusalem was destroyed. When it is rebuilt, however, the Jews, and 
anyone *really* following what Jesus says here, will be performing or 
supporting the animal sacrifices there once again.

I am in no way saying that animals should be slaughtered, or that animal 
sacrifices should be performed. But Jesus certainly wasn't the "Friend of 
All Living Beings" that Srila Prabhupada makes him out to be. Prabhupada 
was dead wrong about that.
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